it happens in every city and every town. we heard the horror stories throughout this economic malaise. i kind of disagree with that statement from the president. gregg: all right. do what extent do union obligations really drag down businesses and economies with, you know, health care for life and these onerous pension benefits no one can really afford? >> you hit the nail right on the head. the bottom line is, listen, we've come a long way when this country absolutely needed unions, workers needed representation to where now unions seem to have their interests at heart before the company, before shareholders and before even the customers. we've seen what the kind of damage it has done in the auto industry, airline industry, trucking, more recently twinkie. of course on the public scale, schools, you can't fire bad teachers. it's a tough sell right now in a free market economy. gregg: 25, 30 years ago, unions were roughly 20% of the workforce. now they dwindled to less than 10%. >> and they continue to dwindle. as people in